frozen bolts

[riVeRraT]

Well, I could use a few ideas on how to get frozen stainless bolts out of an aluminum block, before they snap, and after :(

Any ideas besides drilling them out, and using an easyout, or drilling and tapping?

I got some old motors I want to get apart, and the bolts started snapping.

[Fast Fred]

get some map gas on it, soak them in a penatratein oil first, if thay snap, dependin
on how many snap, you can bring it to a machine shop thay can get the snaped ones out with out fallin off the bolt :cool:

[Jeff Akers]

Well, I could use a few ideas on how to get frozen stainless bolts out of an aluminum block, before they snap, and after :(

Any ideas besides drilling them out, and using an easyout, or drilling and tapping?

I got some old motors I want to get apart, and the bolts started snapping.

I start with a brass punch/hammer, Wack the head of the bolt a few times and spray penatrent on it , I use PB Blaster. If that don't do it, use heat from a torch ( be carefull things can go BOOM! ) "around" the bolt "not on the bolt".
That will let the aluminum expand around the bolt. Wack it with the brass punch/hammer again. Try to remove the bolt.

If that doe's not work and the head breaks off. find an oversized nut to put over the broken bolt. Weld the end of the bolt to the nut and try again!

If that's not an option then you can take it to a shop as Fred said, or Drill and tap until your fed up :( Wipe up any spilled blood and sweat, Go have a bevarege of your choice and rethink why it is you want to do this :eek: :D

Good Luck! :cool:

[riVeRraT]

if that doe's not work and the head breaks off. find an oversized nut to put over the broken bolt. Weld the end of the bolt to the nut and try again!


There, I learned something, and yes why do we do this?
Pb blaster is good stuff isn't it?

Thanks for the tips.

[RichardKCMo]

I start with a brass punch/hammer, Wack the head of the bolt a few times and spray penatrent on it , I use PB Blaster. If that don't do it, use heat from a torch ( be carefull things can go BOOM! ) "around" the bolt "not on the bolt".
That will let the aluminum expand around the bolt. Wack it with the brass punch/hammer again. Try to remove the bolt.

If that doe's not work and the head breaks off. find an oversized nut to put over the broken bolt. Weld the end of the bolt to the nut and try again!

If that's not an option then you can take it to a shop as Fred said, or Drill and tap until your fed up :( Wipe up any spilled blood and sweat, Go have a bevarege of your choice and rethink why it is you want to do this :eek: :D

Good Luck! :cool:

I really like the part about blood sweat and beers,sure sounds like a group or something .
What is the best penetrent to use?
I use Kroil the oil that creeps but i know there must be others.
RichardKCMo

[JohnsonM50]

A cordless drill with an adjustable clutch drive combined with PB, heat etc. and a 1/4 in. socket adapter, 1/4 or 5/16 in socket for screw bits or the size you need and let the clutch rattle the crap outta that bleepin bolt, nut or screw. start with a low setting and power up to your needs. If you need a bit more... a drywall screw gun [plug in] has the same clutch but can break things. For getting broken bolts out I hear but dont have yet.. reversed drill bits work well. From being near salt water you need some tricks. Oh and upon reassembly lately Im using teflon thread sealant forget neverseize. BEER! toast to victory, wallow in defeet or ponder why-for ,;) :cool: its all purpose.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

......there's nothing better than The Master Oil. It's nonflammable, thins rapidly with heat, and will creep deeply and spread far. Apply oil, put some heat down, a little more oil, then wait. Give it overnight if it's something like aluminum threads and steel bolts. Then in the morning more heat, a little more oil then slowly work back and forth. If the head isn't rounded off, just be a little patient with it. If it is, then use some tools that you can work it with pressure left and right until you get some movement. Once you do it is a matter of heat, time and patience for the oil to cover enough of the threads to the point that it overcomes the resistance from corrosion.

Whacking and banging on the head with a hammer can help too, but unless you have deep penetrating power to loosen the hold of corrosion, that alone will often result in twisting off the bolt. With dissimilar metals you have electrolysis involved and that is why, even if you get the bolt out, the threads are so screwed up, you have to put in a helicoil. If you are able to get the bolt out with some lubricant easing the way, then you may just be able to clean up the threads and use a good grease with the replacement bolts. Be aware though that if the bolts bottom out anywhere near a water jacket that you could overgrease and hydraulic the bottom out and cause a water leak.

[jphii1]

Where do you get Master oil?

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

Torch flames and aluminum just don't mix if your going to heat it. Flame heat changes the crystal structure of the case aluminum making it brittle. I use a Black and Decker paint removal type heat gun, heating the bolt head and close area site. While hot give the head a good tap with hammer and punch and then quench with penetrating oil and let sit until cold. Lost very few bolt holes or snapped off bolt heads evers since using this method. Even when it breaks free a bit, add more penetrating oil along the way to gently ease it out by both in and further out turns.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

My brother Mark still makes it, but he only sells to retailers or big industrial users now. Too much government BS for aerosol and too much paperwork for taxing purposes for individual sales. I will ask him where it is available off the shelf, but I know there is probably none anywhere near you unless you have a contact within the Virginia highway department. They use it on the salt spreaders during the winter.

If you know where to find any Lawson products in your area, ask about the oil. That is Master Oil under a different label. Master Oil is much more expensive than petroleum based oils, BUT...it works. At the Lone Star reunion several drivers including Denny Henderson, David Woodell and Bobby Wilson said they still have some. People that have ever used it hide it away and hoarde it because once it is gone they don't know if they will ever find any again. They save it for the impossible jobs.

If you have something that you really need to save and want to try it, let me know & I'll see what I can do.

[Jeff Akers]

My brother Mark still makes it, but he only sells to retailers or big industrial users now. Too much government BS for aerosol and too much paperwork for taxing purposes for individual sales. I will ask him where it is available off the shelf, but I know there is probably none anywhere near you unless you have a contact within the Virginia highway department. They use it on the salt spreaders during the winter.

If you know where to find any Lawson products in your area, ask about the oil. That is Master Oil under a different label. Master Oil is much more expensive than petroleum based oils, BUT...it works. At the Lone Star reunion several drivers including Denny Henderson, David Woodell and Bobby Wilson said they still have some. People that have ever used it hide it away and hoarde it because once it is gone they don't know if they will ever find any again. They save it for the impossible jobs.

If you have something that you really need to save and want to try it, let me know & I'll see what I can do.

So, what you are saying is it's made of UNABTAINIUM:eek: :D ;)

Just kidding Ya Wayne !

I used to have the Lawson products guy come by now and then but now I use Dyna Systems out of Dallas. Do you know if they also sell the "Master oil"?

[Master Oil Racing Team]

....but if you depend on me these days....that just about describes it. Actually, I think there may be some changes in the works, but I haven't talked to Mark in a while. He lives only 12 miles away and we only get together sporadically. He asked me to put together some boat racing photos with The Master Oil featured in them for a brochure he was working on. He still gets calls, primarily from snowmobile people, on the high quality lubricating properties. Unfortunately, for him, he said ....No Big Hurry.

He has a web site and you can access it from BRF. His member name is Master Oil. I guess I need to check it out myself.

In regard to Lawson, I am not sure of how their current operation are, but from my first acquaintence in 1975 they marketed the highest quality product available in the lines they sold. It's a funny story about how The Master Oil became known to them. Maybe I'll share it some day. As far as I know, they don't make anything themselves. They find the best and sell the best...under their name. They sold The Master Oil for twice what my Dad sold it for. And we shipped tons of oil to them.

I was way out front at Hot Springs in 1100 hydro when the primary hot wire to the coil broke. It was 10 or 12 gauge, very stiff, and going down the front straight waves were rebounding from the close shoreline. The boat was pounding against those waves and the wire was vibrating very quickly up and down until it got hot enough that it broke. I showed it to our Lawson rep and he brought me a sample of the same gauge wire that was soft and very flexible. It had a Hypalon sheath. Whenever we encountered those same conditions, the wire had enough flexibility that it dampened the vibration to the point that we never had that kind of failure again. Knowing that Lawson marketed good brands, one day I peeled the Lawson label off the wire spool and found ITT.

And sorry such a roundabout way to answer your question about Dyna Systems Jeff, but...no, they don't sell The Master Oil.

[Jeff Akers]

sorry such a roundabout way to answer your question about Dyna Systems Jeff, but...no, they don't sell The Master Oil.

LoL:cool:
I like your stories Wayne !

I didn't go into why we gave up on the Lawson guy.

We had many good years with them until the salesman (great guy) deid Unfortunatly... after that we had three differant guys in about six months, orders were lost or worse they sent us things we didnt order. one guy even tride to sell us some bolts "NOT THEIR BRAND" out of the trunk of his car:eek: All the while the Dyna Systems guy was knocking on the door so we gave him a try and never looked back!

This is not a knock on Lawson Products as I sead we had many good years with them and there products and I know the quality is/was great!... It's just what we experanced :(

To get back on the topic of this thread:rolleyes: ...I work on saltwater outboards all the time and have used many differant penatraiting oils and found PB Blaster works best so far;)

I would love to try some of the Master oil !

[kevin nichols]

put some heat on it......about 400 degrees the bolt will come out ..put the heat on the block not directly on the bolt........

[ponyboy]

Ok...send the wife to walmart.......and pre heat the oven to 400 deg. put your part in there for 45 min and dont forget to wear your mittens...
and if all else fails use mopar, combustion chamber cleaner, I dont know whats in it But I use it daily for everything thats stuck.
I work at a dodge,jeep,chrysler dealer,
Good luck!!!

[jphii1]

OK, I found Lawson's website and they've got a few different oils. Ther is


“Kwikee” Penetrant contains an additive called Arletone-T (A/T), which has the unusual ability to seek out minute openings and cracks. Also contains moly (molybdenum disulfide) for lubrication and easier disassembly of mating parts.

and this:


# Amazing Oil fixes over 1,000 things
# Penetrates and then converts to a long-lasting protective film that won’t run or wash off
# Convenient, non-aerosol bottle can be taken anywhere
# Lubricates
# Penetrates
# Stops squeaks
# Protects
# Rustproofs

and this:



# Breaks up rust
# Separates frozen parts
# Superior penetration
# Disintegrates rust and hard scale
# Excellent for nuts, bolts or any threaded item

Lawson Non-Flammable Penetrating Oil has been thoroughly tested to ensure compliance with all standards relating to chemical flammability.

Got any ideas which one it is?

[Master Oil Racing Team]

I remembered that the oil that my Dad private lableled for Lawson was a cutting oil that they called "Clear Cut". I talked to Mark and he told me Lawson owns a company in another name that is in North Carolina. He ships them the oil and they private label it in their own containers. But, I didn't have a pencil (will get grief from Joe Rome on that), and I didn't write the name down. I will get Mark to PM you the info.

He also said that Wilson Supply has outlets all over the U.S. where there is oilfield activity. You can get in touch with them through the internet and they will sell a single can. Mark will sell retail, but only by the case, and only out of state where he doesn't have to do the Texas sales tax paperwork.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

The crescent wrench was found by Craig Lawrence under his parents house in Dallas. He handed it to me and asked me to "fix it". I soaked it in Master Oil long enough to get good penetration, then started working the worm gear back and forth until I was able to get full travel and finished cleaning it up with a wire wheel. I had that wrench for many years, but somewhere along the way it got left behind.

[jphii1]

How much is a case? I know at least a couple of poeple who would go in on it with me.

[jphii1]

I just found it on the Wilson Supply site. I guess I should have searched for Master Oil on their site to begin with! I ordered a couple of 16oz squirt bottles.

THANKS!

[Master Oil Racing Team]

I don't know. I'll have my brother Mark contact you.

[Skoontz]

Hi all! New here. We got numerous engines into our shop that came from salt water running where the owners did not flush them properly after they were done. All of the above will work, but when we really got a nasty one we removed the powerhead, built a clay dam and used an ultra sound machine. They sent electronic impulses through the bolt and broke the bond between bolt and block. Someitmes that did not work, and, we ended up using something to guide a drill and would Heli-Coil the threads.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

Hey Joe, I lost this thread a day or so ago and didn't see the post where you found some Master Oil. Let me know how it works out. I was talking with Mark this morning and told him to send a little sample to River Rat, Jeff Akers and Skoontz to try out. He told me he had a distributor in Reno that has some on the Golden Gate Bridge now. The most interesting thing though, is that he told me he has a couple of old letters from boat racers that he is going to E Mail. One is from Ron Hill and the other from Bill Seebold.

[jphii1]

Thanks Wayne. I thought I'd post THIS LINK (http://www.wilsononline.com/productdetail.asp?Searched=True&Num=7434&UNSPSC=15121500) so that anyone else that needs some could find it.

[skiffman1957]

I have always had great success getting out broken bolts by welding a new nut to the broken bolt. If they are stainless then get some stainless rod, place new nut over broken bolt holding it in a vise grip as to steady the nut over the bolt. Then turn the Amp's up just maybe 10 or 20 Amps higher then you would use to weld that thickness of metal. Center nut over bolt, strike an arc in the hole right down over the bolt and fill up the nut with weld. Now you have transfered plenty of heat into the bolt and that helps break the bond between the Alu. & stainless. If you welded the nut correctly you can just turn it out with a wrench. I havent found one bolt that would not come out this way... Good luck...:D

[smittythewelder]

I just got here, and I can't believe that nobody has mentioned left-hand drill bits!! That's right, these are short length bits with a reverse twist, and you have to use a drillmotor that will run in reverse. You use these bits to drill out the broken bolt for an easy-out, in the usual way, but the advantage is that 80% of the time the bolt will back out while you are trying to drill it. Left-hand drill bits were for me the greatest discovery since Mercury Special Tool #1 (an oxy-acetylene torch).

Another good tool, sometimes safer and/or more convenient than any torch, is an A/C arc welder with a carbon-arc electrode. Either single or twin carbons will work; I use a twin carbon torch. With my old Sears "buzz-box" turned off, I set up the torch so that the carbon electrodes are touching both sides of the fastener, then reach back and turn on the welder. It doesn't take a lot of amps. If the fastener is broken off in cast iron, I get it red hot, but I wouldn't get it that hot if it is in aluminum. Then work the fastener back and forth with vise-grips til it will back out. Of course, if you have nothing to grab, weld on a nut as Skifman describes.

Some guys seem to break off a lot more bolts than they should. These are the guys that are always in a hot rush, but they end up wasting a lot of time. They do everything in reverse order!. FIRST, they rip the head off the bolt, THEN they drill, and try an easy-out (and maybe break it), THEN they put on penetrating oil, but they haven't the patiience to let it soak, so they go immediately to a propane torch, THEN a welding torch, etc., etc., etc..

Maybe I'm a pessimist, but when I encounter bolts that look like they could be troublesome (exhaust manifold bolts, ANY fastener on a motor used in Puget Sound!), I soak them overnight (hopefully in Good Ol' Master Oil!!), and apply some heat BEFORE reefing on them.

[QUINAULTRACING]

If you us a container in which you can open and close put in a drop of acetone in your oil. It lowers the tensile strength of the oil and lets it penetrate better. I us MARVEL MYSTERY OIL..steve:)

[smittythewelder]

Interesting, Steve. But can you answer a question I have been asking for over forty years: What's the mystery (in Marvel Mystery Oil)?? Lots of people swear by the stuff, several companies over the years have specified Marvel oil for lubricating their products (remember the Judson vane-type supercharger for Volkswagons?), and nearly everybody has an opinion, but I'd like to know WHAT is the special secret ingredient or combination>

[QUINAULTRACING]

It just works. I my self have been one that was always wanting to know how and why ? But in my years of learing I asked a lot of ?????????? and got the same answer from many. In theroy, oh you don,t have to know why just belive me thats the way it works.................I also add 1 oz. of each acetone and mavel mystery oil to my rigs I drive 2X that if I'm making the run to OROVILLE or a long haul. In the winter engines will start like they were just tuned up..................add same mix of oils to my stock fuel mix to put PRO engine to put it bed. I know a man that has used it for the same, for years, does not know what he is using and never asked. But it will clean a PRO engine like new just marvel and a little RED LINE left when you are all done..steve..22-R......PS I am not really here. I am out at the lake......rained two inchs out there last night. I'm trying to a super on a 180 degree corner with a 15' radis an 12' drop had to just STOP.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

We used to have background info on most of those majors oils and or additives (Marvel, STP, WD 40, etc.), but I don't know what happened to it. I do remember though how the name of WD 40 came about. They were testing formulations for a water displacing penetrating oil. The 40th test was the best. The name came from the test sheet. They are all hydrocarbon based. STP (scientifically treated petroleum) was a cushioning agent. It had friction reducing properties, but mainly it was used like a liquid rubber to give more life to a worn engine. Back in the days of Andy Granatelli the oils were not as sophisticated as today and there were no synthetics. During the course of the Indianapolis 500 (or any of those long races) there was a lot of engine wear. STP kind of filled in the gaps and and kept the internal pieces from slapping around and wearing out so the engine could make the finish. At least that is what I remember

[smittythewelder]

If you ever do find that info, Wayne, I hope you'll post it somewhere, because there are a whole bunch of gear-heads, here and on other motorsports sites, that would be avid readers.

Come to think of it, does anyone remember what that stuff was that Zak was playing with? Somebody here thought it was a rice oil, but maybe he had gotten into the sake (Japan's rice-beer/wine).

The local auto parts place has one of those turn-the-crank oil comparo-machines. Aren't they fun? I can hardly pass one up without giving the handles a spin. The most fun part is looking at that thick, honey-like super additive they are promoting after you have cranked it up the train of plastic gears; oh, it clings real good for sure, but when you look close you can see that it contains a billion tiny bubbles of entrained AIR that you stirred up. Uh, not in MY motor, thank you.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

.... it wasn't the sake somebody up there was into.:D He hit it pretty close to the mark.;) ZAK would buy a five gallon can of MX-237 and bottle it up in small plastic bottles. Just a few ounces. I never saw one and forgot what he called it, but he would sell it as a fuel additive to snowmobilers. He also made a fantastic grease with an MX-237 base that was silver colored. He put that in very small containers with a screw on lid. We would use that on the threads of the studs that screwed into the water jacket of the block and held the head down. When we needed to lap the block to seal off water, it was easy to get those studs out.

As far as thinning an oil, Omark Industries used to thin MX-237 with a product called Shell Sol 70. The were boring rifle barrels 30" or so and they thinned it to keep the oil at the head of the tool. Their tool life increased dramatically and well as decreased the scrap rate.

That clinging oil is good for low speed gears, especially on a long gear train like on a ship where some gears don't get proper lubrication. You're right about the air bubbles in a high speed motor. In a lower unit, it would be like whip cream. Stuck all over the sides while your gears ground themselves to metal flake.

Smitty, I think most of that information was junked when our buildings and shops in Alice were sold. My brother Mark may have some left. I got out all my old boat racing stuff and my Dad's correspondence, but I didn't have room to store all the technical and historical data.

[QUINAULTRACING]

blowoff.com, I have not used their lube job yet but if it works half as good as some of their other products, in might be the best new product on the market. Got the name BLOWOFF 25 -30 years ago, they started out selling canned air to clean key boards. I use their product GETOFF ink and adhesive remover for removing numbers and stickers from boats. Is better than 3M and half the mess..steve..............:) :) :) PS After reading my post about adding acetone to MAVEL MYSTERY OIL. I said it lowered the tensile strength must have been in the sun too much. It lowers the surface tension the same way cool it or any of the products that you would put in your radiator to make it cool better.

[jphii1]

I just thought I'd bring this back to the top. I was oredering some more form WILSON (http://www.wilsononline.com/productdetail.asp?Searched=True&Num=7434&UNSPSC=15121500), and figured the link may cone in handy for someone.

[Bill Van Steenwyk]

Selling Hydraulic Wrenches over the years has given me some insight to removal of studs, bolts, nuts, etc., that for one reason or another won't come loose without some help. I'm talking about some quite large fasteners used on power generation turbine equipment and such. Torque requirements up to 30,000 ft. lbs. and above. I have used lots of Master Oil on tool demos and almost everyone says that is the best lubricant they have ever seen. But I am like most others in not knowing where to get it anymore. Until Wayne's post I didn't know it was still being marketed. I won't be so chintzy with the few cans I have left anymore.

The one method I have seen used, and there is a portable machine that mechanical contractors use on Turbine overhauls, large machinery such as steel mills use, etc., called a "Disintegrator" It is basically a portable EDM machine that instead of machining a finished part from a base piece of material, is placed over the stud or bolt and VERY RAPIDLY just disintergrates the metal leaving a very thin piece that is easily then removed from the hole. I am sure unless you purchased one of these type machines it would be very expensive to hire the contractor for one small job. but perhaps check with EDM folks, either mfgrs., or end users and perhaps you might find someone doing small jobs on an individual basis, probably located around heavy manufacturing areas. Maybe this will help as an alternate source when all else fails.

[RichardKCMo]

Like to hear more , since in Mo. we seem to have lost that .
RichardKCMo
Selling Hydraulic Wrenches over the years has given me some insight to removal of studs, bolts, nuts, etc., that for one reason or another won't come loose without some help. I'm talking about some quite large fasteners used on power generation turbine equipment and such. Torque requirements up to 30,000 ft. lbs. and above. I have used lots of Master Oil on tool demos and almost everyone says that is the best lubricant they have ever seen. But I am like most others in not knowing where to get it anymore. Until Wayne's post I didn't know it was still being marketed. I won't be so chintzy with the few cans I have left anymore.

The one method I have seen used, and there is a portable machine that mechanical contractors use on Turbine overhauls, large machinery such as steel mills use, etc., called a "Disintegrator" It is basically a portable EDM machine that instead of machining a finished part from a base piece of material, is placed over the stud or bolt and VERY RAPIDLY just disintergrates the metal leaving a very thin piece that is easily then removed from the hole. I am sure unless you purchased one of these type machines it would be very expensive to hire the contractor for one small job. but perhaps check with EDM folks, either mfgrs., or end users and perhaps you might find someone doing small jobs on an individual basis, probably located around heavy manufacturing areas. Maybe this will help as an alternate source when all else fails.

[Michael J Gwaltney]

Selling Hydraulic Wrenches over the years has given me some insight to removal of studs, bolts, nuts, etc., that for one reason or another won't come loose without some help. I'm talking about some quite large fasteners used on power generation turbine equipment and such. Torque requirements up to 30,000 ft. lbs. and above. I have used lots of Master Oil on tool demos and almost everyone says that is the best lubricant they have ever seen. But I am like most others in not knowing where to get it anymore. Until Wayne's post I didn't know it was still being marketed. I won't be so chintzy with the few cans I have left anymore.

The one method I have seen used, and there is a portable machine that mechanical contractors use on Turbine overhauls, large machinery such as steel mills use, etc., called a "Disintegrator" It is basically a portable EDM machine that instead of machining a finished part from a base piece of material, is placed over the stud or bolt and VERY RAPIDLY just disintergrates the metal leaving a very thin piece that is easily then removed from the hole. I am sure unless you purchased one of these type machines it would be very expensive to hire the contractor for one small job. but perhaps check with EDM folks, either mfgrs., or end users and perhaps you might find someone doing small jobs on an individual basis, probably located around heavy manufacturing areas. Maybe this will help as an alternate source when all else fails.
I have seen a new product in automotive trade magazines and on SPEED TV. It is CRC Freeze-Off that freezes fastner to allow for easier removal. I haven't tried it but there is an interesting demo video on website. crcindustries.com/freeze-off. Anyone tried it?

[Master Oil Racing Team]

That's a handy link Joe. Wilson was one of the oldest distributors. Nice to see they still handle it.

That CRC Freeze Off could be the answer to some totally incredible salvaging of one of a kind type parts. As you have read previously, we used to apply Master Oil then heat then more oil and more heat to get some expansion and penetrating action going. Just imagine what you could do, especially if you were in a hurrry, by doing the preceeding procedure on the part to save, then suddenly freezing the bolt.:eek:

[Tim Weber]

I have never used the Master Oil. I didn't even know it was available until yesterday. I have had good luck with Kroil for frozen bolts.

What makes Master so good and what are some of its applications other than frozen bolts?

Tim

[Master Oil Racing Team]

A lot of that information is available in prior posts Tim, but here is some background info.

When my Dad first got it patented, the base oil was a byproduct of a certain type of grain process. It has the same ph as the human skin and is not in any way harmful unless you drank it, then you better hang out close to a bathroom for awhile. It won't actually harm you, but you might get very embarrassed. My Dad first became acquainted with it when he was in the Aloe Vera business. The base oil was used as one of the ingredients in their hand cream. When he shut that Aloe business down after a short time, one of the chemists he was working with told him of the fantastic lubricating qualities it had. So they got together and added some extreme pressure lubricants and a few other ingredients--all non hazardous.

At the time they came out with it, sperm oil from sperm whales had just been banned. It was the primary cutting oil for the most extreme jobs. Master Oil was able to duplicate its qualities. And also was a natural and not petroleum based. Master Oil was widely accepted in Gulf Coast refineries after a major explosion and fire was traced back to a petroleum distillate oil. Master Oil is non flammable, and at the time it was tested by Southwest Research in San Antonio it had the lowest coefficient of any oil that they had ever tested.

Since it's nonflammable, heat can be applied (depending on what else nearby might melt or burn) to help the penetrating process. So the fact that it is nonflammable, non toxic, biodegradeable, made from renewable resources and has superior penetrating and lubricating properties makes it a very attractive oil. Unfortunately, it is also much more costly than its competitors. That former waste product is now in demand in certain parts of the world and the base oil is refined for use in industrial cooking processes because it lasts so long before it turns rancid.

Besides a penetrating oil it is good for machine work. In fact on soft metals like aluminum one manufacturer was cutting out a step because the cut was so fine he didn't have to do as much polishing. It stands out on use on the extremes--very soft and very hard metals. We used it somewhat as a fuel additive in our racing engines, but with methanol it is tricky. Mixes perfectly with gasoline. We ran it in our lower units. It is very good for rust protection, but if you put it on moving parts heavily and leave it for awhile, it will get gummy. Then you will have to clean it off. More oil will do that. You can't put it on binoculars or scopes because it will penetrate the seals of the optics and get inside. If you have anything in particular you are thinking about let me know. It will turn copper and brass green.

There have been a lot of synthetics that have been developed since Master Oil first hit the streets in 1966, so there are many more products out their now that could do things that a standard petroleum base lubricant couldn't. I hope this answers your questions.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

On racing applications we didn't warrant its use as their are too many variables. Certain seals will swell. If it was improperly used in storage, it could cause the bearings to spin when you first fired up the motor in the spring. Racers have too many different things they try to eliminate all possibilities that might come up. That said, some of our friends who pretty well knew what it would do ran it.

[Roy Hodges]

Is "the Master oil" a pure synthetic ,made from chemicals , or is it derived from petroleum

[Master Oil Racing Team]

None of the above Roy. It is extracted from a plant through a patented chemical process, though the chemical is not retained in the product. It is basically a crude vegetable oil to put it simply. The crude vegetable oil can be refined like petroleum to be used in cooking, salads, or also for handcreams, etc.

You might remember about 12 or 15 years ago there was some promise of some great lubricating oil that could be produced from the jajoba bean from the desert southwest. It was hailed as a great lubricant that could be produced from a renewable source. We had some samples to test, but I don't remember the results. I think it was some pretty good stuff, but much darker than Master Oil. Like my Dad's oil, I don't think it has ever taken off or reached its full potential. Probably an economics thing also. Petroleum and chemical derivatives are much cheaper to mass produce.

[filthy phill]

Its a very old post now, but WOW what a good read
this needs to be kept alive, so much great information.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

You are right Phill, it is a very old post. I need to go back and reread it myself. The Master Oil was right in the middle of when I started racing, and I grew up with all the trials and tribulations of my Dad trying to get it going. I will go back to the start and maybe be able to add to the story.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

That info was ten years ago almost to the day and older. Was fun to go back and read that old stuff. My brother Mark still makes MX237 The Master Oil, and in fact I remembered I was supposed to e mail Dean Hobart where to buy some.

There is good information there, and I would say that since the older posts, that there must have been lots of advancements in safe penetrating oils. I just don't keep up anymore. Be interesting to hear what else is new.

[DeanFHobart]

That info was ten years ago almost to the day and older. Was fun to go back and read that old stuff. My brother Mark still makes MX237 The Master Oil, and in fact I remembered I was supposed to e mail Dean Hobart where to buy some.

There is good information there, and I would say that since the older posts, that there must have been lots of advancements in safe penetrating oils. I just don't keep up anymore. Be interesting to hear what else is new.

Wayne,

Yes, let me know where I can buy it.

Thanks,

Dean.............