yamaha or tohatsu?

[iwanajohnson]

Alright just looking for some info. anyone in here a yamaha or tohatsu expert. wanting to know if yamaha even makes a 60hp 3 cylinder and same for tohatsu. If there is sutch a motor, are they capable of producing as much hp as a 3 holer omc?

[Roy Hodges]

Alright just looking for some info. anyone in here a yamaha or tohatsu expert. wanting to know if yamaha even makes a 60hp 3 cylinder and same for tohatsu. If there is sutch a motor, are they capable of producing as much hp as a 3 holer omc?.............................................. .....................I am looking at a 2000 evinrude -johnson "product guide" (dealer handbook) & it lists a Yamaha 60 horse 3 holer . it says; 2.83" bore, 2.74 " stroke. 51.8 cubes. ask Fast fred about its potential . I would think , with its long stroke , it oughtta be a torque machine .

[speedmatt]

Hello
I don't know your 3 holer omc but I can say you that yamaha sell a 60 Hp 3 cylinder two stroke.
Look to the link : http://www.yamaha-motor.fr/produits/marine/moteurs_hors-bords/deux_temps/60_70_75_90.jsp
(sorry it's in french but I think you can find t in english)

I know very well yamaha 70, 3 Cylinder, I race with one, there is not a lot of difference with the 60 and it's a really good race engine, but I think fast fred could say you more, because my english is not really really good.

But if you want information on this engine, you can ask me, and I could say you what you have to do for tune it really nice

[Neil_M50D2]

Alright just looking for some info. anyone in here a yamaha or tohatsu expert. wanting to know if yamaha even makes a 60hp 3 cylinder and same for tohatsu. If there is sutch a motor, are they capable of producing as much hp as a 3 holer omc?

What are you going to build? If it is an SE/FE under 50ci, both are a good choice. However, Bass Machines can provide a stock race ready Tohatsu Model M50D2 that dyno's about 58 HP stock, more if you add a down pipe, and even more with some mods. Current cost is about $5,500.
Neil Bass

[Fast Fred]

Yamaha 52cuber been known to pull right up, and past:cool: :eek:
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/1620/yamaha702ug0.th.jpg (http://img256.imageshack.us/my.php?image=yamaha702ug0.jpg):eek:

[Roy Hodges]

[QUOTE=Fast Fred;30632]Yamaha 52cuber been known to pull right up, and past:cool: ..........................................yeah, BUT ; is it legal to run in FE runabout or F E HYDRO ? i think the rules say 50 cubes,(for a looper) max

[iwanajohnson]

I'm not lookin ro run it in any class. outboard drag all mods are allowed, just looking to see what 3 hole motor I could get the most hp and torque out of. thanks.

[Roy Hodges]

I'm not lookin ro run it in any class. outboard drag all mods are allowed, just looking to see what 3 hole motor I could get the most hp and torque out of. thanks.........................................the n get a 90 horse yamaha , or suzuki , or nissan/Tohatsu . they have from 69(plus) cubes (Yamaha) to about 73 cubes (Suzuki) &about that for nissan , or the BEEG Juan - the 3 cylinder Mercury 90 horse @84.6 cubes .

[tthibodaux]

Alright just looking for some info. anyone in here a yamaha or tohatsu expert. wanting to know if yamaha even makes a 60hp 3 cylinder and same for tohatsu. If there is sutch a motor, are they capable of producing as much hp as a 3 holer omc?NO. LET ME SAY IT AGAIN...NOOOO:D :D :D

[RichardKCMo]

Mr. Johnson, if you're in Mo. any time this year come to an NBRA race , you'll see 1 of the fastest FE runabouts Yamy powered all 42+cu. in..
Don't need no stinking 49.7 cu.in. LOL.
RichardKCMo

[Neil_M50D2]

Mr. Johnson, if you're in Mo. any time this year come to an NBRA race , you'll see 1 of the fastest FE runabouts Yamy powered all 42+cu. in..
Don't need no stinking 49.7 cu.in. LOL.
RichardKCMo

I understand thats a highly modified Yamaha 50. No one has taken the time to modify the Tohatsu/Nissan M50D2, which is very simular to the Yahama 50.
However, I percieve the parties in discussion here are more interested in a stock or semi-stock engine for drag racing. If displacement is not an issue, a larger Yahama or Tohatsu/Nissan would better serve their purpose.
Neil Bass

[RichardKCMo]

Also 42+ cu.in., i'll bet a lot of folks here don't what the parent Co. Name is.?
That Bass motor running looks and sounds good , starts good too.
RichardKCMo
I understand thats a highly modified Yamaha 50. No one has taken the time to modify the Tohatsu/Nissan M50D2, which is very simular to the Yahama 50.
However, I percieve the parties in discussion here are more interested in a stock or semi-stock engine for drag racing. If displacement is not an issue, a larger Yahama or Tohatsu/Nissan would better serve their purpose.
Neil Bass

[Fast Fred]

the Tohotsu is the most advanced, of them 50's, cuzz of the divider in the side tranfur ports, it torques better through the low and mid range.:cool:


:eek: :eek: maybe it's cuzz of the class or the rules or some thing, in "X" SLT you can run a 50hp moda, mod the crap out of it, it would just get Killed against
the 49,56 OMC the 52, 59,Merc the Yamaha 52:cool: :eek:

[tthibodaux]

You gettin all this? Sounds like the OMC is the way to go.:D

[tthibodaux]

How funny does iwannatohatsu sound?:p

[Roy Hodges]

Also 42+ cu.in., i'll bet a lot of folks here don't what the parent Co. Name is.?
That Bass motor running looks and sounds good , starts good too.
RichardKCMo....................................... ...............................
- the bass motorator is a Tohatsu , look on the cowl, on the "Avatar". its a 42 incher. For what it is , is great motor. I saw one at the kilos at Oroville , last Saturday . Nice, and a guy running against it had a 44inch merc on a Mk55H tower , he said that Bass Machine motor goes like a stripe-ped *** ape.

[Neil_M50D2]

Cumoon guys, what is all this crapp you are writing if you are looking for the
fastest 50 hp. engine you are on the wrong side of the pond :)

Ever heard of a sertain Mr RAANA and his mod TOHATSU 50?

OK, I will bite. I have never heard of Mr RAANA nor do I understand what you want me to see in the photograph. I am truely interested, so do not take this to be other than honest.
Thanks,
Neil Bass

[tthibodaux]

OK, I will bite. I have never heard of Mr RAANA nor do I understand what you want me to see in the photograph. I am truely interested, so do not take this to be other than honest.
Thanks,
Neil BassHere we go..:rolleyes: :D

[Mark75H]

you can´t see the trick from that angle you have to turn the engine around, you have to ask Mr. RAANA but he is on a trip to China so you won´t be hearing from him for a while , not sure if he is willing to share anyway.

Then what was the point of the picture? :confused:

[Fast Fred]

well, lets think about the exhaust port, stock, it's shape is oval, oval shape make for a wide power band, square off the top and the band becomes peaky,
more power?, no, just moved the peak, but a cleft on top on the right side of the exhaust port would make more power.

[tthibodaux]

Hey Tim I was told that you know this Mr. RAANA, is he fast or not, just wondering:confused: I'm stayin out of this.:D

[tthibodaux]

Alright just looking for some info. anyone in here a yamaha or tohatsu expert. wanting to know if yamaha even makes a 60hp 3 cylinder and same for tohatsu. If there is sutch a motor, are they capable of producing as much hp as a 3 holer omc?Lets get back to the real question.:D This is what iwanajohnson wanted to know.

[Fast Fred]

back to the real question.

yes yamaha makes a 60hp 3cyl, with the 60hp carbs (same as a 50hp) a hot 50hp yam or hot -sue mite stay with it. can a ricer 50hp make as much hp as an OMC, NO,they are small up dated copys of the OMC's, what works on one works on them all, you can put a divider in the side transfur on any of them.:cool:

[tthibodaux]

yes yamaha makes a 60hp 3cyl, with the 60hp carbs (same as a 50hp) a hot 50hp yam or hot -sue mite stay with it. can a ricer 50hp make as much hp as an OMC, NO,they are small up dated copys of the OMC's, what works on one works on them all, you can put a divider in the side transfur on any of them.:cool:Thanks Fred.;)

[Jeff Akers]

I'm stayin out of this.:D

Boring

I was just geting the popcorn ready:p ;) :D

[tthibodaux]

Boring

I was just geting the popcorn ready:p ;) :D:D :D What you talkin bout Jeff?:p

[Jeff Akers]

:D :D What you talkin about Jeff?:p

:D No way Tim, I'm staying out of this ! LOL!:D ;)

[tthibodaux]

:D No way Tim, I'm staying out of this ! LOL!:D ;);) :D :D

[girls race 2]

Did someone say popcorn?:p

[Neil_M50D2]

Yes I fully aggree with Tim back to the question.

Does this open any thoughts, why did TOHATSU put in more ports, a lot of more work, there must be some real benefits from it?

With a divider, the overall transfer port can be wider. A port opening can only be about 65% of the bore in width or the ring will grab the edge. Also, with a divider you can better direct the flow. And, you can increase the velocity as needed.

Might ruin a few blocks experimenting.
Go slowely,
Neil

[Fast Fred]

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7357/fredsmotor41id3.th.jpg (http://img152.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fredsmotor41id3.jpg)
this is a copy of the 56/mod50 omc, with the stock carbs it's not all that, it needs a set of 90hp carbs, like the one on page one. be seein how thay do
up against this hear F-3,:eek: :cool: in 61cubes or less class racin

[speedmatt]

Thomas, OMC F3 were use in F3 class (or O850) and Yamaha 70 CES are use in F4 class (S850).
This 2 engine were really different, one is 'unlimited" and the other have a limited tuning
The OMC have a exhaust over water not the Yamaha

[Fast Fred]

we run a class that would be like (0 1000) or one thousand cc's or less.
put them 70hp carbs on the 50hp. i did run the 52 yamaha in this class, it did well (only with 90hp carbs, with the stock carbs a stock SST60 just pulls away).
some have nicasil liners in them with trick pistons to get the displacement up
in the yamaha. now i'm runin this in that class
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/502/mvc002f2ri9.th.jpg (http://img260.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mvc002f2ri9.jpg)
ya, for what ever reason some can't understan what i'm sayin, ????, so much for university:eek: :cool:

[Fast Fred]

hears the yama ces tuner,made of stainless, the stock one is crome plated, just guna rot and fall off
http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/3892/p3130007in6.th.jpg (http://img110.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p3130007in6.jpg)

[Fast Fred]

the point is, when yamaha decided to make a 3cyl outboard, thay had a mod50
(the one with the 6pack on it), a SST60, and a Stinger on the table, and thay took what thay thought worked best and called it thare own:eek: what works on one Works on All of them:cool:

[Roy Hodges]

the point is, when yamaha decided to make a 3cyl outboard, thay had a mod50
(the one with the 6pack on it), a SST60, and a Stinger on the table, and thay took what thay thought worked best and called it thare own:eek: what works on one Works on All of them:cool:........................................ .....
You tellem, Rapido Frederico ! .....................................I happen to know that Suzuki was interested in the O M C v-6's , also. In 1976 , when the omc V-6 first came out (for retail sale, )Paul Bender ,an Evinrude dealer( &boat racer) got in his first V-6 , he immediately SOLD it to Suzuki. ( at full LIST price) He was also a Suzuki dealer.

[iwanajohnson]

hey guys, I've been away from my computer for about a week and a half, yall are puttin out a lot of good info, I've still gotta read it all but I saw soemthing about stepping up to a bigger motor, I can't do that because I'm only workin in the 3 cyl. class as long as it's got 3 cylinders I can try to use it but other wise with a bigger mtoro I got nobody that'll run me, otherwise I would step up above 3 holers. I'm just tryin to find what engine would make the best motor for this. I also run an outboard jet which also hurts me, I wanna get somethin with a prop but the jet's all I'm stuck with for now. Yall are puttin out a lotta good info though thanks guys.

[Neil_M50D2]

The stock M50D2 Tohatsu has low port timing, Transfer at about 58 degrees, and exhaust at about 82.5 degrees. Taking the exhaust up will allow the torque and HP curve to go up. My calculations tell me that the max usable RPM would be about 8000 RPM. Because the transfer timing is hard to adjust, leave it stock until further testing. My best guess to allow the engine to run at 8000 RPM with good torque and high HP is to move the exhaust timing upward to about 88 degrees. Ideally the transfer port timing should be adjusted upward to about 60 degrees.

For reference: total exhaust open time would be 2x88 degrees and full transfer opening time would be 2x60 degrees.

Anyone have real results?
thanks,
Neil Bass

[Roy Hodges]

I think you better remove that "Rubber Ducky" , before you are in trouble with Terry Klem. The " Rubber Ducky" has been his trade mark and /or boat name , since he (and Noah) launched the ARK . He is the guy who just set the 1100 C C runabout kilo record at 112 mph , with a 600 C. C. Rossi .

[tthibodaux]

hey guys, I've been away from my computer for about a week and a half, yall are puttin out a lot of good info, I've still gotta read it all but I saw soemthing about stepping up to a bigger motor, I can't do that because I'm only workin in the 3 cyl. class as long as it's got 3 cylinders I can try to use it but other wise with a bigger mtoro I got nobody that'll run me, otherwise I would step up above 3 holers. I'm just tryin to find what engine would make the best motor for this. I also run an outboard jet which also hurts me, I wanna get somethin with a prop but the jet's all I'm stuck with for now. Yall are puttin out a lotta good info though thanks guys.Hey Andrew, did ya read my iwanatohatsu joke?:p :D

[iwanajohnson]

Hey Andrew, did ya read my iwanatohatsu joke?:p :D

that's pretty funny, I just read that, lol. I think that the omc products are the only thing that sounds rite in my name, Iwanatohatsu just doesen't roll off your tongue as well.

[tthibodaux]

that's pretty funny, I just read that, lol. I think that the omc products are the only thing that sounds rite in my name, Iwanatohatsu just doesen't roll off your tongue as well.:D :D :D

[iwanajohnson]

so what I'm getting out of all of this great information is you can make any 3 holer run very well no matter what the brand it's all about what you prefer. it's just like any other brand, someone always likes the other one. I've got an omc and love omc, but eeevverryyoonnee around me also has an omc and I'd love to see their looks if I could take somethin else and beat em with it. so which 3 holer would be able to make the most tourque, including omc. tryin to make a fast 3 hole drag boat with an outboard jet, tough task, anyone got an answer...

[Fast Fred]

a MOD or Super Mod56 would be hard to get around.
http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/6259/p1030007oj9.th.jpg (http://img258.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1030007oj9.jpg)
this is a Super Mod56:eek:
this is a Mod56
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8414/p1150011dj6.th.jpg (http://img337.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1150011dj6.jpg)
on a jet it's all about the low end, the impellor stalls about6100rpms for the most part, just can't move much water after that:cool:

[Fast Fred]

?, Stall, like an airplane prop, after about 3000rpm's of prop or jet impellor speed, they can not move more water, or air for the airplane, so it "Stalls".

it's runnin, it's turnin, and the rig is slowin down:eek:
you good this far?:cool:

remeber what the rules are on Mods, NONE, thare no rules:eek: :cool:

[iwanajohnson]

?

remeber what the rules are on Mods, NONE, thare no rules:eek: :cool:

I love that saying rite there!!!:D Thomas not makin fun of ya and not makin fun of fred either but I'm lovin this translation stuff. haha. is the diff. on the mod 56 and the super mod56 the front half or lenght of rods?

[Roy Hodges]

a MOD or Super Mod56 would be hard to get around.

this is a Super Mod56:eek:
this is a Mod56

on a jet it's all about the low end, the impellor stalls about6100rpms for the most part, just can't move much water after that:cool:......................................
SO, cubic inches (or C.C.'s) RULE . Cubes rule ! Low end is ruled by more , & Most cubic inches , get a big block 3 holer . a 90 horse merc or 90suzuki or 90 yamaha or 90 Tohatsu - by now you (should ) get the point . Only thing better than cubic inches is cubic FEET !- cubic Dollars helps a lot , also

[Fast Fred]

i know a guy with a 3cyl drag boat, a river racer, and on any given day on that river, there are no rules on any thing what so ever. my $$$$ is on Him:cool:all day
OMC tripple:eek: :cool:

[iwanajohnson]

i know a guy with a 3cyl drag boat, a river racer, and on any given day on that river, there are no rules on any thing what so ever. my $$$$ is on Him:cool:all day
OMC tripple:eek: :cool:

same thing I'm doin river racin, no rules, so hopefully that's my motor. I like that saying to cubic dollars, haha.

[iwanajohnson]

alrighth eres another question, I need an explination of ports and porting, for example on a square port motor, do ya make prts higher or wider to get different types of power out of them, that kinda stuff neone here go any basic explinations of that kinda stuff?

[Neil_M50D2]

alrighth eres another question, I need an explination of ports and porting, for example on a square port motor, do ya make prts higher or wider to get different types of power out of them, that kinda stuff neone here go any basic explinations of that kinda stuff?

A couple of rules of thumb. Make small changes as you can quickly ruin a block. Find a book on the subject (Two-Stroke TUNER’S HANDBOOK By Gordon Jennings). Talk to someone who has modified the same engine you are working on so you can get the benefit of their mistakes (Fast Fred). Never make a port width more than 65% of the bore. HP is gained by making improvements throughout the engine. All engines have week links, and there is always room for improvement. Probably more and some hilarious stories.

Usually, increasing the port width usually increases torque. Increasing the port height usually increases max RPM. More RPM is usually more HP. Engines have RPM limitations based on rod to stroke length, piston ring type, material strengths and weight of moving parts. The piston’s mean speed should never exceed 3500 ft/min. At high RPM the is a very rapid de-acceleration as the piston stops at the top and comes back down. Depending on the ring type and thickness, at some RPM the ring will lift off their seat and will flutter. This usually breaks a cast iron ring into pieces about 1/16-inches long, just before the engine explodes into pieces. Ductile iron rings do not break, but the lube is blown past the cylinder walls and the engine sticks. There are equations of motion for these subjects that you can get from the named book, or other resources.

This is just the beginning, break a few engines, I did.
Neil Bass

[iwanajohnson]

hah I like tie title on that one, I don't wanna know how to break one I need to know how to keep it togeather, just playin, thanks for the info. where would I be able to find one of those books is it old or would it still be somewhere on the net. thanks

[iwanajohnson]

does that book have some good info in it, it better for as expensive as it is.

[Neil_M50D2]

does that book have some good info in it, it better for as expensive as it is.

If you are worried about the cost of a book, you cannot afford to start modifying an engine.

[iwanajohnson]

If you are worried about the cost of a book, you cannot afford to start modifying an engine.

Yea, good point there, I'm gonna get it I was just kinda shocked, that's as much as my college text books, it's one I acually want though.

[iwanajohnson]

You may be right on that, but iwannachamp just sounds like rockn´roll and then U need,
...well have a look at the small pic below after switching the brand you could then be iamchamp, if you do not switch then you are iamchimp, simple.

Happy tuning

chimp huh, if I switched to a motor that small it'd be slow enough I could have a chimp drive it hehe!!!!:D

[tthibodaux]

chimp huh, if I switched to a motor that small it'd be slow enough I could have a chimp drive it hehe!!!!:D
:p :D ;)IWANA YAMAHOTSUOMC.. You like that Andrew?

[iwanajohnson]

:p :D ;)IWANA YAMAHOTSUOMC.. You like that Andrew?

I like my name, it don't need to be changed, lol, I need to figure out this performance tuning so I can be out threre runnin with yall, how do you pronounce that anyways, it's creative.

[Fast Fred]

Super, Super with carbs, = 46-47+hp per hole with carbs, seems them numbers are not easy to throughdown, no matter how big or how many cyl's it's got.:eek: no spray, all Moda, outboard moda:cool: on gas:eek: :cool:

[tthibodaux]

BRF has a rule about not postin pictures of yourself.:D

[iwanajohnson]

Super, Super with carbs, = 46-47+hp per hole with carbs, seems them numbers are not easy to throughdown, no matter how big or how many cyl's it's got.:eek: no spray, all Moda, outboard moda:cool: on gas:eek: :cool:

throw some spray on one of these and they'd do real good. thinkin about goin to school to do machinist or mechanical engineer, think that'd do any good with high performance engine building.

[Fast Fred]

engineer :cool:
i'm some what parshall to Peg Bundy:cool:
iwanajohnson, hang in thare:cool:

[tthibodaux]

:cool:
i'm some what parshall to Peg Bundy:cool:
iwanajohnson, hang in thare:cool:;) :D :D I think peg is hot..

[iwanajohnson]

guys theres a lot better things out there on tv to look at now than the bundy family, try the girls next door:D Hugh hefner is my idol!!!

[tthibodaux]

guys theres a lot better things out there on tv to look at now than the bundy family, try the girls next door:D Hugh hefner is my idol!!!Man I'm 32. When I was a kid there wasn't a better set than Peg's..;) :D :eek:

[iwanajohnson]

Man I'm 32. When I was a kid there wasn't a better set than Peg's..;) :D :eek:


Plastic surgery has came a long way since then:D :D :D

[tthibodaux]

Plastic surgery has came a long way since then:D :D :DWhat can I even say to that????:eek: :D