What's a "36runabout"?

[jeff55vDSH]

Really. I don't know. Is there a thread here at BRF that can explain?
:confused:
Thanks.

[Mark75H]

36 cubic inch stock gearshift racing class, I think most of the boats were C's and the motors were mostly West Bend Chryslers and OMC's. Merc cut a deal to have 36 replaced with 35ss ... turned out to be a sucker move; 36 runabout drivers did not buy Merc 402x/35ss's and the 35ss class dried up

[jeff55vDSH]

Thanks Sam.
So about how long was the class around? About when did the class dry up?

[RichardKCMo]

Verry Good ? When there was no 30 cu. in class as mercs went from 20 cu. to 40 , i think there was a need to fill in the left over spaces, as classes were limited to ABCD, A being under 20Cu.in B 20-30 which would be C wan't any though , 30- 40 D , scary , rules seem to be so political.
What ever happened to ABCD? I did'nt do it i'm only a spectator, ithink you fella's are you, re own undoing , seen ya' while ago.
RichardKCMo

[Ron Hill]

http://hydroracer.net/forums/showthread.php?t=10099&page=16

The point I was trying to make on HYDRORACER.NET was that in my fifty years in APBA, dropping a class has never helped Boat Racing... I will say it forever, don't drop classes, combine them...

If you look at the life span of a kneeldown racer, they start in J, enjoy J, go to bigger classes get hurt or almost get hurt and they quit.

36 Runabout was a large boat, with a Stock Motor (Forward, Neutral and Reverse)... Schwarzenbach and Stoker were Chrysler dealers..before the Chrysler, they used Evinrude and Johnson motors....

Danny Schwarzenbach kept the class alive by supplying the drivers with motor parts taken off repaired motors. The boats didn't look too racey and they didn't sound fast and they didn't go fast....But SCOA (Southern California Outboard Association) put on most of the races in Region 12 and our Commodore, Race Chairman, Publicity Chairman, and Patrol Boats were all 36 drivers...

They were probably a little older than most, they had time to get to the races Friday and set up the bouys...They had time to write articles for magazines....Or maybe they cared for the SPORT.

In and around 1974, I was racing for OMC and I knew many Mercury engineers. At Morgan City, Louisana (see photo, boat 175 is me...Margarite Woods gave me this photo at Jack Leek's Memorial..) I was talking to Mercury's engineers...

Anyway, I was friendly with the Mercury people and I told them I wanted to buy the tooling for the D Quicksilver. They asked if anyone would be interested in parts??? I told them if they'd make 25, I'd buy them all...

We agreed that they'd make 25, 12 complete gearcases and 13 in parts....

When I returned from the Dayton, Stock Nationals, 1974, I had a COD from Mercury for $2,600....I almost had a heart attack...I was sure I'd go bankrupt with that deal... I went to the races that weekend, and sold 12 for $2,400....

I was selling many props for Mercury and I talked to them daily. I found out they had the tooling for the "D" mid section and I wanted to order 25... As we had just passed the Stock Fishing block rule for "D", I had gotten Mercury to make .030 pistons, and with the new D Feet, I figured I could build motors, cheaply as I had 12-15 fishing "D" blocks already...

Mercury made me an offer to build the 402 XS motor...I ordered one and got number one off the assemblyline. I also broke the Kilo record for 35 SS Runabout and 35 SS Hydro that year, both records were never broken...

The trade off to accepting two new classes in APBA, was to drop 36, a Chrysler class...(I had no knowledge of this deal until it was long done...) The 402 XS motor was a two cyclinder, rough running motor with a heavy flywheel...It had a hard time slowing down once it got going....

After Hank Menzie's death, in 1978...the 35 Class dropped down and out...Another problem, Mercury discontinued this motor, and all the 33.3 blocks cracked in the ports...(May have been from the tuner...)...

We had die hard 36 racers in our club, once 36 was dropped, they quit working and quit racing...Our club was never the same!

[jeff55vDSH]

Ron, Thanks for the history.
I wasn't trying to argue or make any kind of point in reference to the rule 21 proposal. That's why I came here to ask the question, rather than that other nice site.

As always, I am humbled by your experience, and love for the sport.
BTW, I was just starting out in J runabout in 1976.

[Ron Hill]

I feel that Boat Racers have always cared about RACING, not about ABOUT Boat Racing as a Sport...

We always noted that MOST people in APBA's Political Circles, were no longer racing.... People that RACE spend all their time, money and energy RACING...as a result, leadership rolls go to those who want to "RUN" things....and companies sometime have people on pay roll....

I have watched Mercury Marine, since I was a kid. Mercury, when Carl ran it, with his "IRON FIST" wanted ever race to be won with a Mercury. Frequently, they at Mercury didn't just want Mercury to "WIN" they wanted to say "WHO" won with a Mercury.

West Coast Outboard Boat Racing (LASA and SCOA) both SMALL BOATS (Kneeldowners) clubs and Marathon Boat Racing (WOA and COBRA) were holding their own and or growing. Havasu was the Outboard World Championships....Parker was the Big Enduro...We raced on TV. We got articles in the LA Times. Havasu drivers, like Me, we on Live with Regis...We were on ABC's Wide World of Sports...Roy Rogers came to our races..

There were functioning clubs, where TROHPIES were raced for and it was basically Family, Fun and Friends...

At Havasu, 1966, there were 118 boats...Only four were owned by a motor corporation...

Young drivers like myself, Jimbo, and older drivers, Ted May, The Berghauer Brothers, Fred Miller, Burt Ross, and Paul Kalb, all welcomed the chance to race more and get, at least, expenses paid...

Mercury, set up a "COUNTRY STORE" to help racers BUY equipment that they needed for racing.....(Note I said "HELP", this was not a PROFIT CENTER, it was a PROMOTIONAL CENTER)...Around this time, Team Mercury was formed....Of course, Team Mercury had equipment no one could buy...

Mercury High Performance which came from the "Country Store"...and became a "Profit Center" for Mercury rather than a Race Support System... Later, High Performance became Mercury Racing...

AS I see it, Mercury went from trying to HELP RACERS WITH PRODUCT, to trying to help their Bottom Line....which is guess IS THE AMERICAN WAY....

Of course, when you are busy racing, running your own business, raising kids, working with/for APBA somethings aren't clear, until you have 20/20 hind sight...

And the 20/20 hind sight is simple to me...We, as racers should welcome any manufacture into our organization......but, WE, the members should control them, not they control us....Many members think that companies are like the government...They are not here to HELP...Well, they are, but they are here to HELP THEMSELVES...

Chrysler Outboards wanted to market there Performance Engines.....Now, NASCAR, for example, had these cars called MoPars, as I recall...seems maybe they were 383 cubic inch, but they seemed to race against 350 cubic inc engines....Well, can't really recall, except, that Richard "KING" Petty seemed to win a lot of races...seemed his car had lots of power... NASCAR made sure the cars ran the same....Seems they still have more than one brand racing...



Boat Racing, on the other hand, seems to lean toward one motor, one company, and when they wanted out...or raised prices, they comtrolled things...

I'm not blaming Mercury for running other off, I blame myslef and others...

In the year 2007, Mercury Racing is selling more 1,000 HP engine packages per month,....and I'm guessing here, than the ever sold outboard per year. So, Mercury Racing may not have left Outboard Racing, per se, outboard racing left them....


Where I'm going with this is this: OPC, had 118 boats at havasu, 1966...They also had about 14 classes. WOA ran MArathons with two in the boat...(See Leo B. Wildman Photos).http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4237

OPC, year after year cut classes, to a point where they now have:

Sport C, Super Sport, SST 45, SST 120, Champboat, Mod U, Formula 150, Formula V, not one class runs a production boat. Super Sport runs 2006 motors on a Capsuled boat...Where is GRASS ROOTS racing going to come from???


My point again, Nothing good ever came from dropping classes...just less racers...Combine Classes and let them RACE...Run what you BRUNG....Make rules that lets ALL OUTBOARDs race....Nostalgia Rules are the future... A Nostalgia Outboard Class would help re-establish Grass Root Outboarding...

The 36 driver in the Chrysler ad, is Stan Fitts, of APBA Fame...

[Tim Chance]

The record for 1100ccR is held by a 600 c.c. Rossi. 600 c.c. that is pretty close to 36 c.i. 36 Class "all growed up"??

[Roy Hodges]

The record for 1100ccR is held by a 600 c.c. Rossi. 600 c.c. that is pretty close to 36 c.i. 36 Class "all growed up"??................................................ ........................
.................................................. .....................................The johnrudes were 30 & 25 horsepower, the Chryslers were 35 horses. I'd bet that 600 c c Rossi pumps out somewhere around 130-160 horses. Heck , a 2 stroke yamaha 500 c c grand prix bike is up around 200 horses -on gasoline ! that's about 6 &2/3 horses /cubic inch.

[Dan M]

Roy,

Rex Hall had told me last year that the Rossi 4 cylinder 500cc had dyno'ed at just under 200 HP, and they basically ran out of dyno!

Dan:D :D

[Roy Hodges]

well, i won't doubt that. it takes some serious power to take 2 guys over 112 mph in a runabout .

[Hucker]

Thanks Sam.
So about how long was the class around? About when did the class dry up?





I ran an Evinrude on a Hal Kelly "Madcap" back in 1962 and 3 in region 6.
We had about 8 to 10 boats here in South Michigan that covered most all races and had good turnouts.

It was a close bunch of buddies that helped each other when needed.
If you could run 42 mph you usually were in the top 3 or 4 finishers.

We had a blast, I miss it, lots of good memories.

Two names that come to mind are Bob Moore in his speedliner called "Mad Momma" and Gerry Van Conant.

[Ron Hill]

I don't know how to send to him but here is a 36
Boat From the 1956 built by Tommy Tudor from Port Arthur,TX

As I read the Classic Stock Rules....

Any Classic Class can race...Classes can be combined...Seems Classic Stock "SLIPPED" my mind....or I never really read the rules. They are part of APBA...we just need to start racing them...

At Havasu Landing Mickey Schwarzenbach was there working on Rod Zapf's Classic Outboard 2.0...both Rod and Mickey raced 36...Rod raced with Dan Schwarzenbach,,,Mickey's dad...back when The Bandit was KING...

We only had 2 Classic Outboards last weekend, but the club took in 240 for having them run with the SST 120's....both drivers loved racing...Had we required three boats, the club would have lost $240...and two drivers would not have had a blast...

36 was killed maybe 30 years ago, but we still see Ken Scoville, Jr, Lane Curry, Tito Smith, Rod Zapf, and Mickey Schwarzenbach at the races....30 years after THEIR class got dropped from APBA...


CLASSES SHOULD NEVER BE DROPPED...COMBINED......There are fewer Cracker Boxes in APBA TODAY, than there were 36 Runabouts when it was dropped from APBA.....What would APBA do with out Cracker Boxes?????

I think I race Rod's 36 at Puddingstone March 28-29, 2009....Bring back 36 Runabout..as Classic Stock!!!!!